Kogler in an interview: – Hate for the Greens? “Don’t shock me”

“Kron”: Mr. Kogler, your comment on the “farting and grumbling” issue really got the news going. How much do you contribute to the large response?
Werner Kogler: I have taken back these two words because they are inelegant, inappropriate and ultimately unintelligent. The accusations that were clearly on the table were immediately refuted. However, it is legitimate to defend yourself when accusations are made in private chats. What is really at stake are important EU questions: should we eliminate or expand climate protection? Weaken or strengthen democracy?

The fact is that the accusations of the Bohrn Mena couple had been known for weeks. Why haven’t the Greens developed a crisis strategy?
These were conversations between Lena Schilling and her close circle of former friends. From Lena’s point of view, this never had any impact on the audience and that is why the comparison was made. If the couple in question reaches a settlement and then advertises the settlement through the editors – then that is strange to say the least. By the way, this method is completely new in this dimension, the Journalism Council also says this and even the media talk about breaking taboos. And where a wording in defense of a climate protection fighter went wrong, we apologized.

The next mistake happened during the second press conference and Silberstein methods were discussed: so things went suboptimally several times…
Olga Voglauer has – as you say – apologized. In any case, it was stated that the Red-affiliated Bohrn-Menas and other people from left-wing circles with close ties to the Social Democrats and KPÖ brought individual private messages to the media; and thus a completely distorted picture was created. That’s not even disputed.

The Greens have put up posters in election campaigns: “What chooses decency?” Did Lena Schilling behave properly?
First of all, I see that Lena Schilling has been talking to her closest friends. The new situation is that chats have been searched using keyhole methods. That’s what’s remarkable here. That’s why I wonder: how should this develop further? And the issue of decency in the election campaign in Ibiza had to do with the fact that Austria must develop away from corruption. That the judiciary does not die a silent death, but must be saved in terms of budget and personnel. That the procedure is conducted independently, regardless of the person or organization. And it worked – that’s political decency.

Didn’t it shock you that Schilling wrote in the chat: “I’ve never hated anyone as much as I hate the Greens in my entire life.”?
No that’s not true. And that for two reasons. She writes in the past tense. It is also clear that she is a young climate warrior who is struggling with the question of whether she should make the transition from activism to politics. I also experienced this in a personal conversation with her. I can understand that 1:1. And we agreed that the common fight for climate protection is a priority and that we do not have to agree on every position. That’s a good thing, because we want to give this movement and this young woman a place. Lena Schilling’s development should be respected and not constantly criticized. A person’s private life is being dragged into the public eye like never before. The election campaign should be a competition of the best ideas, and for me the central question is how we can make the lives of everyone living in Europe better. Democracy is at enormous risk because Putin has been waging a disinformation war against Europe since 2016. If we don’t come together soon, we will eventually ask ourselves: When did we lose the race for our way of life? Instead, we’re dealing with keyhole chats. This means that the questions that are crucial for the future are missed.

French President Emmanuel Macron found dramatic words for the development during his state visit to Germany. He said the Union “could die if we don’t make the right decisions.” You clearly see it the same way…
The situation is dramatic because nothing can be taken for granted. Liberal democracy and the rule of law are under attack from without and from within. I think it is irresponsible to attack the European unification project in this way. The perpetrators are the right-wing extremists and right-wing populists who jointly help carry out Putin’s shameful work. In Austria this is the Kickl-FPÖ. But those who want to go along with all this right-wing populist stuff with a wink and a wink must also be held responsible. Because you have to understand the European Union well. With 27 Member States it can only work with compromises. You also have to take the different political trends into account. That is difficult in our own country. Therefore, one cannot denounce every compromise at EU level.

Let’s move on to domestic politics. Dispute about the renaturation law and the national climate plan. Nothing will happen in the final phase of the coalition, especially when it comes to environmental issues. In fact, sparks fly. Why didn’t the Greens actually want an early election date to end this torment?
In the last four years of the Green government’s participation, more progress has been made on climate protection than in the previous thirty years. We accelerated from the braking lane to the passing lane. We will be one of the first countries in the EU to generate electricity exclusively from renewable energy sources – thanks to the consistent work of Leonore Gewessler. Greenhouse gas emissions are falling faster than we expected – and, and, and… This all happened with the ÖVP. It makes sense that there will always be friction. There are still many fossil lobbyists who want to regain their influence. We are working to ensure that climate protection and economic development go hand in hand.

And specifically about renaturation. How do the Greens want to reinforce their beliefs?
Renaturation is a major and central project of the Union to ensure nature conservation, so that nature has more space again. We already do some of this in Austria, so I don’t understand the resistance at all. The states have blocked everything – and these are the black and red governors of the state. I think it would be welcome if Mayor Michael Ludwig and Governor Peter Kaiser reconsidered things now. But until a few weeks ago they agreed with the ÖVP state governors. If Ludwig, Kaiser and Doskozil had not agreed to the uniform state declaration in the first place, the problem would not have arisen. Now there is a legal problem because Vienna and Carinthia must clarify how the old resolutions disappear and are no longer legally binding. If Red State governors have sinned before, now is the time to confess, repent and reform.

Let us assume that this legal problem will be resolved by Vienna and Carinthia. Should Environment Minister Leonore Gewessler vote for the law in Brussels, against the wishes of Agriculture Minister Totschnig and Finance Minister Brunner?
It often happened that individual ministers voted differently than their departmental colleagues would have liked and that was exactly the case. If agricultural matters are negotiated in such a way that nature falls behind, the reverse is also likely to be the case.

So in a nutshell: Yes, Leonore Gewessler should vote for the renaturation law in Brussels…
Yes of course. This directive is a kind of life insurance for nature and soil protection and for this protection the uniform position of the states must now be abolished.

Finally, let’s look again at FPÖ leader Herbert Kickl. You’ve been railing against him for over a year. Compare him with Viktor Orbán. But even scandals such as the espionage affair around Egisto Ott, where clear traces can be found in the FPÖ, reflect on him. Doesn’t that frustrate you?
No. If anything, it encourages me to have this argument. I was certainly one of the first to start criticizing his Orban role model. But – and this is positive: more than 50 percent are not infected by it. All the talk about the People’s Chancellor and system parties is nonsense and, like many other things, Nazi jargon. It is a problem that many people can no longer identify these expressions and fewer and fewer people are angry. Otherwise, Kickl itself is the system. As SPÖ club chairman Kucher has shown, he simply raises much more money than he should earn from his position. How this happens needs to be explained. The biggest mess is that he avoids the subpoena before the parliamentary subcommittee and instead laughs down the mountain somewhere. This is a mockery of the representatives and therefore of the people by a so-called people’s chancellor.